Jul 03, 2025 Historic Preservation Advisory Board

[00:00:03]

HERE THIS EVENING AND WISH TO SPEAK DURING A PUBLIC COMMENT SECTION.

PLEASE COMPLETE A SPEAKERS CARD, STATE YOUR NAME AND ADDRESS AND FOR THE RECORD AND LIMIT YOUR REMARKS TO THREE MINUTES.

WE ASK THAT YOU BE CONCISE IN YOUR COMMENTS AND SPEAK ONLY ONCE, IF NECESSARY, TO CLARIFY OR TO ANSWER QUESTIONS POSED BY THE AUDIENCE.

CITY STAFF WILL BE CALLED UPON TO RESPOND TO ANY QUESTIONS THAT MAY HAVE BEEN RAISED BY THOSE IN THE AUDIENCE.

THE BOARD REQUESTS THAT WE ALL TREAT EACH OTHER WITH RESPECT. FOCUS ON THE ISSUES, BE CONCISE IN YOUR COMMENTS AND AVOID OVERLOOKING THE ISSUE.

WE ALL WANT TO ACT IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE CITIZENS OF MCKINNEY, WHILE MAINTAINING THE HERITAGE AND HISTORIC CHARACTER OF THE HISTORIC DISTRICT. DO WE HAVE ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS ON THE NON PUBLIC HEARING AGENDA ITEMS? WE DO NOT. ALL RIGHT, LET'S MOVE ON OR TURN THE PAGE AS THEY SAY.

WE'LL MOVE ON TO THE CONSENT AGENDA. FIRST ITEM IS ITEM NUMBER 2529 33 MINUTES OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION ADVISORY BOARD REGULAR MEETING OF JUNE 5TH,

[CONSENT ITEMS]

DO WE HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND. MARCIA PRYOR ROBERTSON IS THE SECOND.

LET'S GO AHEAD AND VOTE ON THAT. ARE WE VOTING BY DIGITALLY OR BY HAND? DIGITALLY SIGNING IN. I HAVE TO SIGN IN. YOU ARE SIGNED IN.

JUST KIND OF DO IT ON THIS. OKAY. THERE WE GO.

THERE WE GO. THERE WE GO. YEAH. OKAY. TRUST. EVERYONE HAS CAST THEIR VOTES.

I HOPE SO. MOTION IS PASSED UNANIMOUSLY. ALL RIGHT, LET'S MOVE ON TO THE REGULAR AGENDA.

[Consider/Discuss/Act on a Request by Owner Brian Miller for a Certificate of Appropriateness for the Rehabilitation of the Residential Structure Located at 401 N Bradley Street (REQUEST TO BE TABLED)]

TWO. THIS IS CONSIDERED DISCUSSED. ACT ON REQUEST BY OWNER BRIAN MILLER FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR THE REHABILITATION OF THE RESIDENTIAL STRUCTURE LOCATED AT 401 NORTH BRADLEY STREET. THIS WAS TABLED FROM THE PREVIOUS MEETING.

RAY ALLEN WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION. STAFF RECOMMENDS THE TABLE THE ITEM TO THE AUGUST 7TH, 2025 MEETING PER THE APPLICANT'S REQUEST.

DOES THE BOARD HAVE ANY QUESTIONS WITH REGARD TO THAT? IS THERE ANYTHING YOU. THIS IS JUST PURELY A REQUEST BY.

THEY WANT TO WAIT 30 MORE DAYS. ALL RIGHT. LET'S I THINK WE CAN VOTE ON THAT CAN WE NOT? ALL RIGHT. WOULD SOMEBODY LIKE TO MAKE A MOTION? I'LL MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE THE REQUEST BE TABLED UNTIL OUR AUGUST MEETING.

ALL RIGHT. DO WE HAVE A SECOND? OUR SECOND. SECONDED BY KERRY KENNEDY.

ALL THOSE IN FAVOR, VOTE ACCORDINGLY. AND ALL THOSE OPPOSED.

I'LL VOTE ACCORDINGLY.

ALL RIGHT. THE MOTION PASSES THAT THAT ITEM WILL BE MOVED TO THE AUGUST 7TH MEETING OF THE HISTORIC PRESERVATION ADVISORY BOARD.

[Consider/Discuss/Act on a Request by Owner Gregory Dawson for a Certificate of Appropriateness for Demolition of the House Located at 402 Barnes Street]

RAY ALLEN WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION. GOOD EVENING, BOARD MEMBERS.

THIS EVENING I'M GOING TO BE BRINGING FORWARD A REQUEST FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS FOR DEMOLITION OF THE HOUSE LOCATED AT 402 BARNES. AND THE OWNER IS HERE THIS EVENING.

SO THIS PARTICULAR HOUSE IS A FOLK VICTORIAN STYLE HOUSE.

IT WAS BUILT CIRCA 1889, AND IS LISTED IN THE 2023 HISTORIC RESOURCES SURVEY AS A HIGH PRIORITY HOME.

HIGH PRIORITY MEANS THAT IT CONTRIBUTES SIGNIFICANTLY TO LOCAL HISTORY OR BROADER HISTORICAL PATTERNS, AND IS AN OUTSTANDING OR UNIQUE EXAMPLE OF ARCHITECTURE, ENGINEERING, OR CRAFTED DESIGN, AND RETAINS A SIGNIFICANT PORTION OF ITS ORIGINAL CHARACTER AND CONTEXTUAL INTEGRITY. AND THESE ARE PHOTOS OF ITS PREVIOUS CONDITION. AND THESE ARE SOME PHOTOS OF WHAT IT CURRENTLY LOOKS LIKE TODAY.

DURING AN ATTEMPTED FOUNDATION REPAIR, THE HOME HAD TO BE LIFTED OFF ITS PIER AND BEAM FOUNDATION,

[00:05:07]

SO YOU CAN SEE QUITE A BIT OF THE DAMAGE THAT WAS DONE WHEN IT FELL.

AND IN THIS SLIDE AS WELL, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE WALLS AND THE STRUCTURE WERE COMPLETELY TWISTED AND WARPED BY THE FALL, AND IT DISTORTED THE STRUCTURAL FRAME AS WELL.

AND THEN THE PICTURE ON THE RIGHT IS A PICTURE OF THE INTERIOR, WHERE YOU CAN SEE THAT THE FLOORS SEPARATED FROM THE WALLS.

AND THERE WAS SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE BECAUSE OF THE FALL.

AND STAFF DOES RECOMMEND APPROVAL OF THE REQUEST FOR THE DEMOLITION OF THE HOUSE BECAUSE THE STRUCTURE, THE WALL, THE ROOF, CONNECTIONS, THEY HAVE ALL BEEN COMPROMISED AND ATTEMPTS TO MOVE IT BACK ON TO ITS FOUNDATION IS LIKELY TO RESULT IN ADDITIONAL DAMAGE. AND YOU DO HAVE THE FULL ENGINEERING REPORT IN YOUR PACKET.

THE BOARD HAS FOUR OPTIONS. THEY CAN APPROVE, APPROVED WITH CONDITIONS, DENY OR ISSUE A 90 DAY DELAY AFTER THE 90 DAY DELAY.

THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS WOULD BE ISSUED IN A MOTION TO APPROVE THE ITEM APPROVES THE REQUEST FOR DEMOLITION.

AND THIS CONCLUDES MY PRESENTATION. THANK YOU.

THANK YOU. ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR RENA? I KNOW WE HAVE THE PROPERTY OWNER HERE AS WELL.

WOULD YOU LIKE TO SAY ANYTHING OR. I JUST WANT TO SAY I'M SICK ABOUT THIS HAPPENING.

THAT THAT HOUSE BELONGED TO MRS. BETH. SHE WAS A SCHOOL TEACHER FOR 15 YEARS IN MCKINNEY ISD.

EVERYBODY WENT TO SCHOOL. I HAD HER AS A TEACHER.

WILL YOU COME UP TO THE MIC? YEAH. COME ON UP TO THE MIC THERE.

THANK YOU. WHEN WHEN SHE PASSED AWAY, I BOUGHT THE HOUSE FROM HER DAUGHTER.

AND THAT WAS THE HARDEST PHONE CALL I HAD TO MAKE WAS TO HER DAUGHTER AND TELL HER WHAT HAPPENED.

BUT I'M GOING TO REBUILD. I'VE TAKEN TWO ROOMS OF HARDWOOD FLOORS OUT OF IT.

I'VE TAKEN SHIPLAP. I HAVE EVERY SINGLE DOOR, EVERY PIECE OF TRIM, ALL IN STORAGE.

SO I'M GOING TO REBUILD SOMETHING SIMILAR. CASEY AND I TALKED ABOUT, I CAN'T REALLY REBUILD THE EXACT SAME THING, BUT I'M GOING TO REBUILD SOMETHING VERY SIMILAR.

AND THAT'S THE PLAN. SO I DROVE BY THE OTHER DAY, AND IT JUST KIND OF MAKES ME SICK LOOKING AT IT.

OH IT DOES. I GO BY THERE EVERY DAY AND IT'S HORRIBLE.

AND MY FOUNDATION GUY SAID, IN 29 YEARS OF DOING FOUNDATIONS, HE'S NEVER HAD THIS HAPPEN.

AND I'VE ONLY HEARD OF ONE OTHER INSTANCE WHERE IT WAS JUST IT ROTATED OFF THE JACKS.

THEY WERE JUST NOT. NOBODY KNOWS WHAT HAPPENED.

THEY HAD IT ABOUT 20IN IN THE AIR, AND THEY WERE JUST ABOUT DONE.

THEY ALREADY HAD SOME PIERS PLACED UNDERNEATH THE WALLS.

THAT'S WHAT CAUSED A LOT OF THE DAMAGES, BECAUSE WHEN IT FELL, THOSE PIERS PUSHED UP.

YEAH. AND BUT, YOU KNOW, MY INSURANCE DECLARED IT A TOTAL LOSS.

AND I DON'T KNOW. IT WAS SAD. BUT I'M GOING TO DO THE RIGHT THING.

I'M GOING TO I'M GOING TO. I GOT EVERYTHING OUT OF THERE THAT I CAN REUSE ON A NEW HOUSE.

AND WE'LL KEEP THE KEEP THE HISTORY ALIVE. GOOD, GOOD.

ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. DAWSON? IT'S REALLY UNFORTUNATE FORTUNATE THAT THE HOUSE IS LOST BECAUSE IT WAS SUCH A JEWEL AND IT WOULD COST.

I'M SURE IT'S APPRECIABLE. I'M VERY REGRETFUL THAT YOU HAD THIS HAPPEN.

IT'S REALLY A NEGATIVE FOR YOU AND THE COMMUNITY.

JAMES, HAVE YOU SEEN IT HAPPEN BEFORE? HAVE YOU SEEN A HOUSE FALL? YES. I REMEMBER WHEN THE WILSONS LIVED THERE, AND THERE WERE A LOT OF CELEBRITIES THAT CAME THROUGH THERE, TOO. IT HAD A LOT OF HISTORY. YEAH. WE REGRET YOUR COST AND YOUR DIFFICULTY.

YOU KNOW, I HAD I HAD MISS STAPLETON AND I WENT TO SCHOOL WITH IAN AND MIKE, SO AND THEN I KNEW THE WILSONS, TOO. SO I'VE BEEN. I'VE BEEN AROUND THAT HOUSE, AND I.

I KNOW THAT YOU YOU MUST BE SICK ABOUT IT, BUT I AM SO APPRECIATIVE THAT YOU HAVE TAKEN EVERYTHING OUT OF THERE THAT CAN BE USED.

AND THAT THAT MAKES THAT'S THAT'S GREAT. THAT'S A FUNNY STORY.

I RESTORED MISS BETH'S PARENTS HOUSE OVER ON LEE STREET.

OH, YEAH. AND TO OWN BOTH OF THOSE HOUSES WAS A TOTAL COINCIDENCE.

BUT SO I HAVE A LOT OF HISTORY WITH THIS FAMILY.

[00:10:01]

YOU KNOW. SO. BUT THEY'VE BEEN WONDERFUL. THEY'VE, THEY'VE, THEY'VE BEEN WONDERFUL.

SO. AND THEN THE A FRAME IS I MEAN, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO DO ANYTHING.

WHEN, WHEN WAS THAT A FRAME BUILT. WHEN WAS IT A FRAME WAS BUILT IN 1962.

OKAY. BY THE WILSONS. THE WILSONS? IT WAS MRS. WILSON'S FATHER AND A HELPER. I HAVE SOME PICTURES AND.

NO ENGINEERING. NO NOTHING. IT WAS A BACKYARD PROJECT.

AND YOU KNOW, SO I HAVE SOMEBODY LIVING IN THERE NOW, AND WE'RE LOOKING TO SEE WHAT WE CAN DO WITH THAT.

BUT IT'S IN VERY BAD SHAPE. SO THAT'S THE NEXT THING FOR ME TO TURN MY FOCUS ON IS TO SEE WHAT I CAN DO.

YEAH. BUT YEAH. WE'LL SEE. IT'S PROBABLY THE ONLY A-FRAME IN MCKINNEY.

I KNOW IT'S THE LAST A-FRAME, AND I'LL DO THE SAME THING.

IF I CAN'T FIX IT, I'LL REBUILD IT, YOU KNOW? AND I'VE GOT SOME NEAT IDEAS IF THAT COMES AROUND HOW TO REBUILD BOTH OF THOSE STRUCTURES AND STILL LEAVE THEM WHERE YOU DRIVE BY AND GO, HEY, THAT'S COOL. YEAH.

YOU KNOW, SO THAT'S THAT'S THE GOAL HERE. BUT I'VE RESTORED SEVERAL HOUSES ALREADY.

I LIVE OVER ON COLLEGE STREET IN THE 1904 HOUSE, AND I'VE DONE ABOUT FOUR HOUSES ALREADY, AND I'VE LIVED HERE IN THE DISTRICT FOR TEN YEARS, AND I'M IN MY FIFTH HOUSE.

WOW. SO I JUST KIND OF HOP AROUND AND FIX HOUSES.

SO WILL YOU ATTEMPT TO RECREATE THE THE STYLE OF THE HOUSE? CASEY AND I TALKED ABOUT THAT, AND I WILL TAKE THE ELEMENTS THAT I CAN TAKE AND MAKE IT LOOK VERY SIMILAR, BUT I. I CAN'T DUPLICATE IT. CORRECT. OKAY. BUT I CAN TAKE ALL THE GINGERBREAD DETAIL, AND I TOOK I TOOK ALL OF THAT OFF ALSO. SO I HAVE THE GINGERBREAD DETAIL FROM THE FRONT OF THE HOUSE, THE ROMAN COLUMNS, THE PEDIMENT AROUND THE FRONT DOOR. I HAVE ALL OF THOSE PIECES AND I THINK WE CAN DO TO HELP.

WE'D LIKE TO HELP YOU DO THAT. YEAH, I KNOW A GOOD ARCHITECT, IF YOU'RE INTERESTED.

SO I HAD SOME GOOD IDEAS, BUT IT'LL ALL BE GOOD FOR YOU ALL.

SO WE LOOK FORWARD TO THAT. I JUST WANTED TO ASK, WHEN DID THE FOUNDATION REPAIR HAPPEN.

WHAT? WHERE ARE WE? WHAT WAS THAT? THREE MONTHS AGO.

I THINK IT WAS AROUND THREE MONTHS AGO. OKAY. SO I BOUGHT THE HOUSE ABOUT FIVE YEARS AGO, AND I'VE HAD TWO DIFFERENT TENANTS IN THE HOUSE.

BOTH WERE KIND OF CHARITY CASES, AND THEY JUST NEEDED.

I HAD TWO DIFFERENT PEOPLE THAT NEEDED A PLACE TO LIVE. AND THE FIRST ONES, I DIDN'T EVEN CHARGE RENT.

THE SECOND ONE, I JUST GOT A THOUSAND BUCKS. AND HE STAYED THERE FOR SEVERAL YEARS.

AND SO I NEVER REALLY RESTORED THAT HOUSE. I WENT IN AND I PAINTED IT, AND I MADE SURE EVERYTHING WORKED, AND IT WAS NICE, BUT YOU COULD TAKE A TENNIS BALL AND ROLL IT ACROSS THE FLOOR.

IT WAS SO BAD IN THERE. SURE. SO WHEN THAT TENANT MOVED OUT, I FIGURED IT WAS FINALLY TIME.

LET'S LET'S RESTORE THIS ONE. AND THAT WAS THE FIRST STEP.

IS THAT FOUNDATION HAD NEVER BEEN TOUCHED SINCE 19, SINCE 1889.

IT WAS STILL ON THE BOAT STUMPS. NO PIER, NO ANYTHING.

SO THAT WAS THE FIRST ATTEMPT TO EVER PICK THAT HOUSE UP IN 130 YEARS.

WOW. YEAH. WOW. SO. ANY MORE QUESTIONS FOR MR. DAWSON? NO. WE'RE REALLY SORRY THAT HAPPENED.

YEAH, THAT'S A SHAME. BUT IT'S REALLY GOOD THAT YOU'RE, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO DO WHAT YOU CAN.

AND I KNOW YOU'RE REALLY. IT'S GOT TO BE A HEARTBREAKER FOR YOU.

IT'S HARD, BUT I'M KIND OF EXCITED TO BUILD SOMETHING THAT'LL LAST ANOTHER HUNDRED YEARS, YOU KNOW? AND I THINK THAT'S THAT'S GOING TO BE THE GOAL HERE. SO YEAH, CLEARLY BOTOX DUMPS THE ANSWER BECAUSE MINE'S ON BOTOX STUMPS, TOO. WHAT'S THAT? I SAID BOTOX STUMPS ARE THE ANSWER.

MINOR. I'M NOT SURE HOW THEY COULD RECOGNIZE THAT.

THOSE STUMPS WOULD LAST FOR 100 YEARS. I HAD A NEIGHBOR WHO TOLD ME HE TOOK A CHAINSAW TO A BORDER FENCE POST AND BROKE THE CHAINSAW.

I BET I BET THEY'RE JUST CONCRETE. YEAH. THEY'RE CONCRETE.

ALRIGHTY. WELL, IF THERE ARE NO MORE QUESTIONS FOR STAFF OR MR. DAWSON CAN I HEAR A MOTION? WITH REGARD TO THIS, I MAKE A MOTION TO APPROVE.

DO I HAVE A SECOND? I'LL SECOND IT. GO AHEAD.

[00:15:03]

JOHANNA, YOU GOT TO PUNCH IT. OH, I DID, I THINK.

LOOK, WE'RE GETTING BETTER AT THIS. IT JUST TAKES A YEAR TO.

THIS IS NOT A MOTION TO ADJOURN RIGHT NOW. OKAY.

OH. ALL RIGHT, SO THE MOTION PASSES UNANIMOUSLY TO ALLOW THE DEMOLITION. LET'S MOVE ON TO THE DISCUSSION ITEMS.

[DISCUSSION ITEMS - No Action Taken]

KATHY BAUMGARTNER IS GOING TO THE PLANNING MANAGER WILL MAKE A PRESENTATION.

ALL RIGHT. THANK YOU SO MUCH. SO THIS IS JUST A QUICK REFRESHER ON THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS PROCESS.

IN PREVIOUS YEARS, Y'ALL HAVEN'T SEEN AS MANY OF THOSE, BUT I KNOW THAT SEVERAL HAVE COME FORWARD, SO I JUST WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT BRIEFLY. AND STAND FOR ANY QUESTIONS AFTER THE UDC OF THE DEFINITION OF CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS IS ESSENTIALLY IT'S JUST CERTIFYING THAT THE PROPOSED WORK ON A PROPERTY WITHIN THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT, OR ANY LOCALLY DESIGNATED HISTORIC LANDMARK BY THE CITY OF MCKINNEY, IS COMPATIBLE WITH THE HISTORIC CHARACTER.

SO WHAT DOES THAT ACTUALLY MEAN? TANGIBLY, WHAT THAT MEANS IS ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE, THAT'S WHAT OUR PACKET LOOKS LIKE.

OUR CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS PACKET THAT'S POSTED ON OUR WEBSITE.

ANYTIME SOMEONE WANTS TO DO A DEMOLITION OR AN ADDITION OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

WE SEND THEM THAT PACKET, AND THAT PACKET KIND OF LAYS OUT EVERYTHING THAT WE NEED AS WELL AS THE APPLICATION ITSELF.

AND THEN ON THE RIGHT HAND SIDE, ONCE THEY'RE DONE FILLING OUT THAT APPLICATION AND HAVE ALL THEIR MATERIALS, THEY SUBMIT IT THROUGH OUR CITIZEN SELF-SERVICE PORTAL OR CSW.

THAT'S ALL ONLINE. AND THAT'S JUST KIND OF WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE WHEN YOU SEARCH FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS.

SO NOW THAT YOU KIND OF KNOW HOW TO DO IT WHAT ACTUALLY IS REVIEWED IN A COA? THE SHORT ANSWER IS ON A COMMERCIAL BUILDING.

IT'S BASICALLY ANYTHING THAT'S EXTERIOR THAT INCLUDES WINDOWS THAT MAYBE YOU DON'T EVEN SEE.

THAT MAY BE AT THE BACK IN AN ALLEY OR, YOU KNOW, ENCLOSED BY A BUNCH OF OTHER BUILDINGS.

IT STILL INCLUDES THAT IF IT'S ON THE EXTERIOR.

WHEREAS FOR RESIDENTIAL, RESIDENTIAL, WE'RE ONLY REVIEWING THINGS THAT ARE VISIBLE FROM THE RIGHT OF WAY.

BUT FOR BOTH, WE'RE LOOKING AT ADDITIONS WINDOWS, DOORS, ACCESSORY BUILDINGS, DEMOLITION.

ON COMMERCIAL, I WILL SAY WE DO REVIEW PAINT COLORS.

RESIDENTIAL WE DO NOT, WHICH IS A QUESTION WE GET ASKED QUITE A BIT.

SO WHERE IS THAT? WHERE DO PEOPLE NEED A COA? COA IS ARE ONLY REQUIRED WITHIN THAT H OVERLAY DISTRICT.

SO THAT'S THAT MIDDLE PORTION THAT HAS THE HASH LINES THROUGH IT.

THE AREA AVAILABLE FOR SOMETHING LIKE OUR TAX EXEMPTION.

THAT IS A MUCH LARGER AREA, WHICH YOU CAN SEE IS THE KIND OF BACKGROUND FROM OUR PREVIOUS SURVEY.

WE DO KNOW THAT THERE ARE PROPERTIES THAT COULD BE ELIGIBLE TO BE A LOCALLY DESIGNATED LANDMARK OR ANOTHER DISTRICT, OR EXPANSION OF THE DISTRICT. WE KNOW THOSE ARE POSSIBILITIES OUTSIDE OF THE OVERLAY.

HOWEVER, THEY AREN'T PART OF OUR PROCESSES. YOU KNOW, A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS IS ONLY REQUIRED INSIDE OF OUR H OVERLAY.

JUST A QUICK QUESTION. DOES A DEMOLITION, REGARDLESS OF WHERE IT IS IN THE CITY, REQUIRE COA? NO. OKAY. SO A DEMOLITION. OKAY. A DEMOLITION A COA IS ONLY REQUIRED INSIDE OF THE H OVERLAY.

OKAY. SO WHY IS THIS PROCESS IMPORTANT? SO, NUMBER ONE, IT PROMOTES SENSITIVE REHABILITATION AND NEW CONSTRUCTION. IT KIND OF GIVES YOU THE PROCESS BEFORE ANY DEMOLITION OCCURS, AS WELL AS ANY OF THE REHABILITATION, AND HELPS PRESERVE THAT CHARACTER AND SENSE OF PLACE.

BUT I THINK IT'S ALSO IMPORTANT TO RECOGNIZE THAT COAS ARE ALL ABOUT PERSPECTIVE.

THERE'S THE CARROT SIDE, WHICH IS WHAT YOU KNOW, I SEE IS WHY THE PROCESS IS IMPORTANT.

[00:20:01]

IT'S IN ADDITION TO OTHER CODE REQUIREMENTS. SO THAT'S WHY A DEMOLITION OUTSIDE OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DOESN'T REQUIRE THIS.

IT'S BECAUSE IT'S NOT PART OF IT'S NOT PART OF THE REGULATIONS OUTSIDE OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY.

SO JUST AS A RECAP COAS ARE REQUIRED FOR ANYTHING IN THE AIR OVERLAY AND ANY LOCALLY DESIGNATED HISTORIC LANDMARKS.

CURRENTLY, THE CITY OF MCKINNEY DOESN'T ACTUALLY HAVE ANY INDIVIDUALLY DESIGNATED LOCAL HISTORIC LANDMARKS.

WE JUST HAVE THE LARGER HISTORIC OVERLAY. AND THEN COA IS OUR REGULATORY PROCESS.

THAT'S BOTH A BENEFIT AND AN OBLIGATION OF BEING LOCALLY DESIGNATED.

AND WITH THAT, I WILL STAND FOR ANY QUESTIONS.

I KNOW BETTY CAN'T STAND IT. I KNOW IT, YOU KNOW, I WAS THINKING THAT, TOO.

WELL, I MEAN, I CAN'T I I'M SURE YOU GOT I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY CALLS YOU GOT ABOUT THAT HOUSE ON TENNESSEE STREET.

AND BECAUSE IT IS OUTSIDE OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY.

BUT IT WAS A PRIORITY ONE HOUSE. SO THERE WASN'T ANYTHING THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DONE TO PREVENT THAT FROM HAPPENING OR EVEN GOING THROUGH THE PROCESS, BECAUSE I DON'T KNOW WHAT SHAPE THE HOUSE WAS IN.

AND, YOU KNOW, IT MAY HAVE BEEN A SITUATION THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE A CHOICE, BUT IT WENT THROUGH WHAT PROCESS? BECAUSE IT WAS HIS. IT WAS A PRIORITY ONE. WHAT PROCESS DID THAT HOUSE GO THROUGH? SO EVEN THOUGH WE KNOW THAT THERE ARE HIGH PRIORITY HOUSES OUTSIDE OF THE HISTORIC OVERLAY, THOSE PROPERTIES DON'T GO THROUGH ANY SORT OF EXTRA PROCESS.

WE KNOW THAT THEY'RE THERE, AND WE KNOW THAT THEY COULD BE LOCALLY DESIGNATED, BUT THERE'S NO ADDITIONAL LAYER OF PROTECTION BECAUSE THEY AREN'T DESIGNATED.

SO THAT PROPERTY WOULD HAVE JUST WENT THROUGH THE NORMAL DEMOLITION PERMIT PROCESS.

AND SO THAT JUST THAT GOES WITH CITY CITY STAFF THAT DOESN'T FALL UNDER YOU THAT SO THAT DOESN'T GO IN FRONT OF YOU.

CORRECT. NO, I THINK IS I DON'T UNDERSTAND, BUT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT OF THINGS I DON'T UNDERSTAND.

SO UNTIL WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO EXPAND OUR OVERLAY DISTRICT, IS THERE ANYTHING THAT CAN BE DONE THAT IF A HOUSE, IF A STRUCTURE IS IDENTIFIED AS HIGH PRIORITY TO PUT ANY ADDITIONAL STEPS IN PLACE, OR IS THAT I MEAN, SO WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING CURRENTLY? I THINK THE WAY THAT MOST CITIES APPROACH THIS IS BY EDUCATING, BY TRYING TO MAKE PEOPLE AWARE THAT, HEY, YOU DO HAVE SOMETHING THAT'S SIGNIFICANT, YOU HAVE SOMETHING A VALUE HISTORICALLY, BUT ULTIMATELY IT IS A PROPERTY OWNERS RIGHT TO DEMOLISH IF THEY'RE NOT WITHIN THE DISTRICT.

THEY DON'T HAVE TO GO THROUGH THAT REGULATORY PROCESS.

SO OUR BEST BET IS TO TRY TO EXPAND OUR THAT HISTORIC OVERLAY.

EITHER THERE'S OPTIONS TO EXPAND THE HISTORIC OVERLAY TO INDIVIDUALLY DESIGNATE PROPERTIES, TO HAVE A DIFFERENT KIND OF HISTORIC OVERLAY THAT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE CONNECTED.

THERE ARE OTHER OPTIONS FOR LOCALLY DESIGNATING PROPERTIES.

THAT JUST TAKES A LOT OF PUBLIC OUTREACH AND THE PROPERTY OWNER NEEDS TO CONSENT TO IT.

THAT SORT OF THING. IS THAT OKAY? HOLD ON. I HAVE A COUPLE OF QUESTIONS.

SO LET ME REWIND. HISTORIC OVERLAY. HOW WAS THAT ESTABLISHED TO BE THAT SPECIFIC AREA? I KNOW WE'VE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE, BUT I CANNOT REMEMBER.

AND THEN HOW WOULD WE GO ABOUT EXPANDING THAT OR WHAT DOES THAT LOOK LIKE? SO THAT WAS ESTABLISHED IN THE 80S. WHEN CODES AND STATE LAWS WERE ALL VERY, VERY DIFFERENT.

I GUESS THE, THE BIG OVERVIEW IS THAT BACK THEN WHEN IT WAS ACTUALLY ESTABLISHED YOU DIDN'T NEED 100% BUY IN FROM PROPERTY OWNERS. IT WAS IT WAS A BIT EASIER TO GET A LARGE HISTORIC DISTRICT.

SO YOU WILL SEE A LOT OF CITIES HAVE ONE GIANT HISTORIC DISTRICT, AND THEN THEY'LL HAVE A BUNCH OF LITTLE SMALL ONES.

THAT'S BECAUSE NOW THERE ARE MORE REGULATIONS ABOUT HOW YOU GET PEOPLE TO SIGN OFF ON BEING IN A DISTRICT.

YOU ALSO WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY STILL HAVE THE INTEGRITY.

SO YOU WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT IF YOU'RE DESIGNATING A DISTRICT THAT IT'S STILL, YOU KNOW, HAS THE HISTORIC FEEL, HAS THAT HISTORIC CHARACTER IN IT.

IF THAT WAS SOMETHING WE WANTED TO PURSUE. SO, LIKE WITH THE HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY FROM 2023, THEY GIVE US RECOMMENDATIONS OF AREAS TO LOOK AT.

[00:25:03]

AND TRYING TO SEE KIND OF A A PLAN OF WHO WOULD WE WANT TO START WITH OUTREACH FIRST.

AND WHO WOULD BE INTERESTED. GOTCHA. AND THEN.

OH, SORRY. SORRY. GO AHEAD. NO, I WAS JUST GOING TO ASK, CLARIFY ABOUT THE INDIVIDUALLY DESIGNATING LOCAL LANDMARKS. IS THAT KIND OF THE IDEA BEHIND TORY'S PROJECT RIGHT NOW FOR HOLY FAMILY SCHOOL AND CHURCH ON THE EAST SIDE? NO.

THAT'S DIFFERENT. THAT'S DIFFERENT. OKAY. SO THAT IS AN UNDERTONE MARKER, WHICH IS A STATE SUBJECT MARKER.

SO THAT IS NOT LOCALLY DESIGNATED. LOCALLY DESIGNATED WOULD ESSENTIALLY BE IF IT WAS JUST ONE SITE, IT WOULD BE LIKE THE OVERLAY IS ONLY ONE PROPERTY.

OKAY. GOTCHA. OKAY. YEAH. THAT'S JUST A QUESTION.

IS THAT SOMETHING WE COULD LOOK INTO FOR THAT PROPERTY.

YEAH. IF THE PROPERTY OWNERS WERE INTERESTED IN BEING LOCALLY DESIGNATED THAT IS SOMETHING THEY COULD PURSUE.

YEAH. THAT'S JUST SOMETHING I'VE THOUGHT ABOUT A LOT.

I KNOW I BROUGHT THIS UP WHEN WE HAD OUR JOINT MEETING WITH COUNCIL TWO YEARS AGO.

A YEAR AGO, I DON'T KNOW, A YEAR AGO JUST ABOUT HOW THAT CHURCH SPECIFICALLY IS NOW BEING UTILIZED BY A SISTER CHURCH FROM OUT OF TOWN, AND THEY'VE STARTED MAKING A LOT OF YOU KNOW, CHANGES THAT ARE POSITIVE.

BUT WE WANT TO MAKE SURE THEY'RE NOT DOING TOO MUCH.

SO THAT IS SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE OF INTEREST, I THINK.

I'LL TALK TO TORI ABOUT THAT AND SEE WHAT THOSE PLANS LOOK LIKE.

SO I DID TAKE THE OPPORTUNITY TO TALK TO BOTH JERRY AND PATRICK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THIS.

AND THEY WERE RIGHTFULLY CIRCUMSPECT ABOUT WHAT THEY COULD OR COULD NOT DO, BUT THEY DID TALK TO CITY ATTORNEY MR. HAUSER ABOUT IT A LITTLE BIT TO SEE WHAT OPTIONS WE HAVE.

THE BIGGEST CONCERNS WAS THE LEGALITY OF BEING ABLE TO CHANGE SOMETHING IN THE CODE.

AND SO I'M THINK THEY'RE PURSUING IT TO SEE WHAT MIGHT COME OUT OF IT.

AND MAYBE IT'S POTENTIALLY TIED TO WHERE WE HAVE APPROVED A COA FOR HIS REAL ESTATE OR PROPERTY TAX ABATEMENT. THAT MAY GIVE US A LITTLE BIT MORE FLEXIBILITY.

MY ARGUMENT, FRANKLY, CASSIE, WAS THAT YOU HAVE PURVIEW OVER THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT, BUT ALSO IN SOME REGARDS OVER TAXES OR TAX ABATEMENT.

IN THE HISTORIC NEIGHBORHOOD IMPROVEMENT ZONE HAS AS WELL.

SO IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THERE THERE SHOULD BE AN EXPANSION, BASICALLY, OF YOUR RESPONSIBILITY BECAUSE YOU NEED ANOTHER HAT TO WHERE, AS FAR AS I'M CONCERNED. BUT ANYWAY, YOU KNOW, I, I, YOU KNOW, WE'VE SEEN TWO DEMOLITIONS IN THE LAST COUPLE OF YEARS, THE ONE ADJACENT TO THE YARD. THAT WAS A HIGH PRIORITY HOME THAT NEVER WENT BEFORE HPB AND IS NOW WHY I THINK DEMOLITIONS IN THE HISTORIC OVERLAY DISTRICT GO BEFORE US.

AND NOW THIS ONE IS NOT IN THE DISTRICT. AND I GOT SEVERAL CALLS ON IT AS WELL.

AND IT JUST, YOU KNOW, IT. WE ARE A CITY THAT SAYS THAT WE CARE ABOUT HIS HISTORIC PRESERVATION.

WE'RE NOW A CLG INDICATING THAT THAT'S SOMETHING IMPORTANT TO US.

AND THEN WE HAVE A HIGH PRIORITY HOME THAT JUST GETS DEMOLISHED WITHOUT ANY HEADS UP TO YOU BECAUSE YOU DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT TILL AFTER IT HAPPENED.

AND I REALIZED THAT IT DIDN'T MAKE ANY DIFFERENCE WHETHER YOU SAW IT OR NOT.

BUT IT SEEMS LIKE IF WE'RE GOING TO TALK THAT TALK, WE SHOULD WALK THAT WALK WHEN IT COMES TO PRESERVATION, AND IT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE WE'RE DOING IT AS A CITY. AND I DON'T THINK IT'S ON PURPOSE. I THINK IT'S JUST SOMETHING WE NEED TO ADDRESS. SO JUST TO CLARIFY, SO YOU'RE SAYING THAT TO DO THIS HISTORIC DESIGNATED, IT COULD BE ONE HOUSE, IT COULD BE 2 OR 3 HOUSES.

YEAH. SO THERE'S NO IF YOU DID INDIVIDUALLY DESIGNATE A PROPERTY, YOU CAN DO JUST ONE, OR YOU CAN HAVE WHAT'S CALLED DISTRICTS.

MCKINNEY IS UNIQUE BECAUSE WE JUST HAVE THE ONE GIANT DISTRICT.

BUT IF OTHER CITIES, IF YOU LOOK AT LIKE THE CITY OF PLANO, THEY HAVE A LOT SMALLER DISTRICTS AND THEY'RE LIKE PATCHES.

SO WHAT IS YOUR STRATEGY FOR KIND OF GOING FORWARD WITH THAT? ARE YOU LOOKING AT PERHAPS THE HOUSES THAT ARE SIGNIFICANT THAT ARE REAL CLOSE TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND THEN KIND OF WORKING YOUR WAY OUT FROM THAT? SO STAFF IS WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT INITIALLY IS ANYTHING THAT WAS RECOMMENDED IN THE HISTORIC RESOURCE SURVEY.

SO THEY HAD IT WAS MOSTLY ONES THAT WERE CLOSER TO THE OVERLAY, BUT THEN THEY ALSO HAD SOME THAT WERE DETACHED FROM IT.

[00:30:06]

IT SEEMS LIKE THE FOLKS THAT WOULD BE MAYBE MORE INTERESTED IN DOING THAT WOULD BE THE ONES THAT ARE THAT HAVE GOTTEN HOUSES CLOSE TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT BECAUSE THEY KIND OF LIKE THAT. SO THAT MIGHT BE.

YEAH. AND I MEAN, BEFORE ANYTHING WAS PURSUED, WE WOULD HAVE TO DO A LOT OF PUBLIC OUTREACH, AND WE WOULD HAVE TO UNDERSTAND HOW THOSE PROPERTY OWNERS FEEL ABOUT IT.

RIGHT. AND WHETHER THEY'RE IN FAVOR. WELL, THEY'D HAVE TO BE IN AGREEMENT TO DO IT. AND SO IF THEY WERE, SAY, I WAS ONE OF THOSE HOMEOWNERS AND I AGREED TO IT, AND BETTY WAS MY NEIGHBOR AND MARCIA WAS MY OTHER NEIGHBOR, AND THE THREE OF US WANTED TO DO IT. IS THAT SOMETHING THAT HAS TO CHANGE IN THE CITY CODE, OR IS IT JUST IS IT JUST A PROPERTY OWNER? AND OUR OUR RELATIONSHIP WITH YOU.

AND THEN WE WANT TO GO FORWARD WITH IT. SO IF THEY IF PROPERTY OWNERS WANTED TO MOVE FORWARD, THERE'S IN THE CODE, THERE'S A PROCESS OUTLINED.

IT ACTUALLY GOES BEFORE THE PLANNING AND ZONING COMMISSION AND THEN GOES TO CITY COUNCIL. AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS BECAUSE IT'S KIND OF ALTHOUGH IT'S NOT A ZONING CHANGE, IT'S KIND OF TREATED SIMILARLY TO A ZONING CHANGE.

WOULD THAT COME BEFORE US AT ALL OR. NO? IT DOESN'T NECESSARILY HAVE TO IF IT DOESN'T COME BEFORE Y'ALL, THEN AS THE HBO, I HAVE TO MAKE A SORT OF A RECOMMENDATION.

GOTCHA. CASSIE, HOW MANY HIGH PRIORITY DO YOU HAVE ANY IDEA AS FAR AS HOUSES? IS THAT A CRAZY QUESTION OR. THAT'S NOT A CRAZY QUESTION, BUT I DO NOT KNOW THE NUMBER OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD.

I DIDN'T EXPECT YOU TO. I JUST THOUGHT I'D ASK.

I'M GLAD. I WISH I HAD A MEMORY LIKE THAT, BUT I DO NOT.

THAT'S OKAY. WE ALL DO. SO WE'RE STILL WORKING ON THE ARCGIS, RIGHT? YES. SO CURRENTLY, THAT HAS. WHAT WE'RE WAITING ON IS FOR HIM TO UPLOAD ONE OF OUR GIS MEMBERS TO UPLOAD THAT TO THE WEB MAP.

SO WE'RE ON THE FINAL STEP OF IT. THE LAST UPDATE THAT I RECEIVED WAS THAT IT WOULD BE DONE BY MID-AUGUST.

OKAY. THAT'S EXCITING. SO YEAH, IT IS EXCITING.

SO MAYBE AS A COURSE OF ACTION GOING FORWARD.

NOT THAT I WANT TO MAKE WORK FOR YOU GUYS. BUT I WANT TO MAKE WORK FOR YOU GUYS.

THAT'S WHAT WE'RE HERE. YOU KNOW, WE'VE GOT THE RECOMMENDATIONS FROM THE FOLKS THAT DID THE SURVEY.

BUT IT MIGHT BE INTERESTING TO SEE. JUST KIND OF WHAT AREAS MIGHT POP UP IF WE SAID, OKAY, WELL, LET'S LOOK AT ALL HIGH PRIORITY. LET'S ALL LOOK AT ALL MEDIUM PRIORITY.

IS THERE A, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING THAT COULD JIM MANDER.

WHAT'S THE WORD I'M LOOKING FOR GERRYMANDERED INTO POTENTIALLY EXPANSION OF HISTORIC DISTRICT.

I KNOW IT'LL TAKE TIME, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE THAT MIGHT BE FROM, FROM OUR STANDPOINT AS A BOARD AND AS YOU, AS A PRESERVATION OFFICER, SOMETHING THAT WE MIGHT WANT TO APPROACH AND SEE IF IT'S WORTHWHILE CHASING AND IF IT'S EVEN REASONABLE.

I MEAN, IF, AGAIN, IF THEY'RE JUST LITTLE LOCAL DOTS HERE AND THERE, YOU KNOW, MAYBE IT'S A LITTLE BIT MORE DIFFICULT TO DO.

BUT IF THERE ARE AREAS THAT COULD BE GERRYMANDERED, THAT MIGHT NOT BE A BAD IDEA.

AND THEN WE KNOW WHAT OUR TARGET IS AT THAT POINT IN TIME.

AND YOU'RE PROBABLY ALREADY LOOKING AT IT. AND I'M JUST TELLING YOU STUFF YOU ALREADY KNOW. NO THAT'S OKAY. SO WE ARE LOOKING AT IT.

BY SEPTEMBER, WE WANT TO HAVE A DECISION ON WHERE WE WOULD WANT TO MOVE FORWARD IF WE WANT TO MOVE FORWARD WITH ANY OF THOSE.

OKAY. IT'S MOST INTERESTING TO SEE WHERE OUR CURRENT HISTORIC DISTRICT ALLOCATION OCCURS AND HOW IN THE TIMES THAT WE'RE GIVEN THAT ARE APPROPRIATE TO HISTORIC PRESERVATION.

WE'RE LOOKING AT THE WORLD WAR II PERIOD IMMEDIATELY THEREAFTER NOW IS COMING ONLINE.

AND THERE ARE PROPERTIES IN THIS OUTLYING AREA THAT ARE SIGNIFICANT, AND PEOPLE OFTEN ARE UNABLE TO AVAIL THEMSELVES OF THE SURVEY OR OTHER INFORMATION. SO IT IS, AS WE NOTICED WHEN WE CREATED THE HISTORIC DISTRICT, IT WAS A TREMENDOUS INDUCEMENT TO PEOPLE TO KNOW ABOUT THE PLACES THAT WERE THERE, AND IT BASICALLY SPURRED RESTORATION AND REDEVELOPMENT ALONG THOSE LINES.

AND I KNOW THE COST OF CONSTRUCTION BEING WHAT IT IS, IT MAKES IT DIFFICULT TO TEAR DOWN BUILDINGS.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, KNOWING WHAT'S THERE PROMOTES RESTORATION.

AND THIS IS AN APPROPRIATE FIELD FOR US TO ACHIEVE AN UNDERSTANDING WITH THE PUBLIC AND BE SUPPORTIVE OF IT.

I WOULD AGREE, I THINK EDUCATION IS KIND OF THE FIRST STEP IN GETTING PEOPLE TO APPRECIATE WHAT THEY HAVE AS WELL AS, YOU KNOW, PUT MONEY INTO THE MAINTENANCE OR THE RESTORATION OF IT AND THE PRESERVATION OF IT.

THAT YOU WOULD HAVE TO GAIN CONSENT FROM ANY INDIVIDUAL HOMEOWNER THAT WOULD BE DESIGNATED CORRECT.

[00:35:01]

SO THAT MIGHT BE, YOU KNOW, IT MAY BE TRICKIER THAN WE THINK SOMETIMES TO GAIN CONSENT FROM THOSE HOMES THAT WE FEEL LIKE SHOULD BE DESIGNATED AND HOMEOWNER MAY NOT FEEL THE SAME WAY IS COMING.

I THINK IT'D BE PROBABLY A GOOD IDEA TO EXPLORE HOW WE CAN CREATE INCENTIVES TO WIN THEM OVER.

WELL AND I MEAN YEAH THAT GOES WITH EDUCATION TO WRITE THE HOUSES INCENTIVE PROGRAM THAT DOES EXIST.

LIKE MAYBE SOMETHING IN ADDITION TO THAT. OH MY GOSH.

WE MAY HAVE TO SEPARATE. SEPARATE THOSE TWO. IT WON'T BE THE FIRST TIME.

CASSIE, THIS IS KIND OF OFF OFF SCHEDULE. BUT DOES ZONING AFFECT ELIGIBILITY FOR HIS FUNDS? LIKE, IF SOMEBODY IS IN A PD AS OPPOSED TO RESIDENTIAL? DOES THAT AFFECT THEIR ABILITY? NO. YOU JUST HAVE TO BE WITHIN THE DISTRICT WITHIN THE AREA WHICH IS THE BOUNDARY THAT YOU SEE UP THERE, THE BIG WHITE ONE.

I'M JUST CURIOUS. BUT HAS ALSO IS LIMITED TO PEOPLE WHO HAVE A HOMESTEAD EXEMPTION ON THE HOUSE.

SO ANYTHING LIKE A COMMERCIAL PROPERTY ISN'T GOING TO BE ELIGIBLE FOR THAT.

THAT'S GOOD. ALL RIGHT. YOU CLICKED IT AGAIN.

TOM KEEPS PUSHING BUTTONS. I WAS WATCHING BRIAN MILLER? I'M JUST PUTTING IT AWAY FROM ME NOW. I HAVE A QUESTION.

JUST FOR CLARIFICATION AGAIN, ABOUT I KNOW THAT THE BOARD DOES NOT GET SAY OVER COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES.

WHY IS THAT? IS THAT HAVE WE DOESN'T GET SAY OVER WHAT? OVER LIKE DEMOLITION OR THINGS LIKE THAT. LIKE THE PROPERTIES THAT COME BEFORE US ARE RESIDENTIAL ONLY AND NOT COMMERCIAL.

IS WHAT IS THE REASON FOR THAT? I DON'T KNOW IF I'VE HEARD THAT BEFORE.

I WOULD HAVE TO LOOK INTO IT. I THINK DEMOLITIONS COMING BEFORE THE BOARD.

IT'S JUST A POLICY. IT'S NOT NECESSARILY WRITTEN INTO THE UNIFIED DEVELOPMENT CODE.

AND AS TOM MENTIONED, WAS AN OUTGROWTH OF SEEING SOME RESIDENTIAL PROPERTIES THAT WERE DEMOLISHED.

SO I'M SURE THAT'S WHY THAT STARTED. HOWEVER, STAFF BRINGS FORWARD ANY SORT OF CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS THAT STAFF DOESN'T FEEL COMFORTABLE APPROVING. SO, FOR INSTANCE, THERE ARE COMMERCIAL PROPERTIES THAT HAVE COME FORWARD.

THE FIRST ONE THAT I CAN THINK OF IS THE 101 SOUTH CHESTNUT.

THAT'S RIGHT. WHICH WAS A COMMERCIAL PROPERTY RIGHT THERE BESIDE OF LIKE GRADY LANE AND RESIDENCE.

YES. ACROSS WHICH THAT ONE IS EMPTY. YEAH. MY UNDERSTANDING WAS THAT THE HARDWARE STORE WAS REALLY DOING IT FOR THEIR OWN USE. NO, I, I THOUGHT WHEN THEY BROUGHT THAT FORWARD, IT COULD BE INCORRECT, BUT THEY'D ALREADY HAD SOMEBODY THAT WAS READY TO START THE BUSINESS.

BUT NOW WE'RE SITTING HERE LOOKING AT A BUILDING THAT WAS DEMOLISHED, CREATED, AND IT'S EMPTY.

YEAH, THAT'S THAT WAS MY UNDERSTANDING. I MEAN, I'D HAVE TO LOOK AT THE MINUTES.

I JUST FOR SOME REASON, I GUESS I THOUGHT AND I, I WOULD HAVE TO LOOK AT THE MINUTES TOO.

BUT I KEEP DRIVING BY THERE AND I FEEL LIKE I REMEMBER IT WAS FOR THEIR OWN USE DOWNSTAIRS AND THEN UPSTAIRS.

THEY WERE GOING TO HAVE SOME KIND OF RESTAURANT OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, BUT THEIR PROBLEM IS IT WOULDN'T BE ADA COMPLIANT.

RIGHT, RIGHT. BECAUSE THEY DON'T I DON'T THINK THEY HAVE AN ELEVATOR. YEAH.

BUT THAT WAS JUST SOMETHING THAT THAT'S WHY THAT'S ACTUALLY WHY I ASKED THE QUESTION.

BECAUSE I REMEMBERED SEEING THAT AND I WAS LIKE I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S HAPPENING WITH THAT.

I MEAN, WE SAW THEM UNION BEER AS WELL. YEAH.

UNION BEER. YEAH. OKAY. KASEY MIGHT BE TIRED OF STANDING, BUT I'M SURE SHE'D FEEL A FEW MORE QUESTIONS.

IF YOU ALL HAVE SOME. I HAVE ONE QUESTION, BUT I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN.

I DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN, BUT YOU ALWAYS GIVE ME THE HARD QUESTIONS.

[00:40:02]

OR ARE WE PROTECTED FROM THAT OR IF IF YOU DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER, COULD YOU MAYBE AT THE AUGUST MEETING, MAYBE LOOK AT THAT AND SEE, BECAUSE I JUST I DON'T KNOW HOW THAT AFFECTS THE HISTORIC DISTRICT.

ANOTHER LEGISLATIVE BILL YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.

WHAT I WOULD SAY, YOU KNOW, IN ANY SORT OF FOR THAT BILL IN PARTICULAR.

SO IT'S TALKING ABOUT YOU'RE ABLE TO PUT MULTIFAMILY ON ANYTHING THAT'S ZONED COMMERCIAL IS WHAT BETTY IS TALKING ABOUT.

WHAT I WOULD SAY IS THE HISTORIC DISTRICT HAS A MIXTURE OF ALL SORTS OF USES.

BUT I YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT WHEN WE'RE REVIEWING THESE CERTIFICATES OF APPROPRIATENESS IS THE DESIGN.

IT'S NOT NECESSARILY THE FUNCTION. OKAY. SO IF IT'S REALLY WELL DESIGNED TOWNHOMES.

TO US, THAT'S NO DIFFERENT THAN A REALLY WELL-DESIGNED SINGLE FAMILY HOME OR A REALLY WELL DESIGNED COMMERCIAL BUILDING.

SO IF IT COMES TO THE HISTORIC DISTRICT AND SOMEONE'S PROPOSING THAT IT WOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH STILL THE CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS PROCESS, AND THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING PLANNING AND ZONING WOULD HAVE TO SEE AND APPROVE BEFORE IT HAPPENED.

YEAH. SO IT WOULD BE JUST LIKE ANY OTHER SITE PLAN.

I'M I'M OUT OF QUESTIONS. I DON'T TRUST THAT END.

ALL RIGHT, KATHY, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR SPENDING PROBABLY FAR MORE TIME THAN YOU ANTICIPATED.

I THINK SHE KNOWS US BY NOW. I THINK SHE KNOWS SHE'S PRETTY SMART.

ALL RIGHT. DO WE HAVE ANY GENERAL CITIZEN COMMENTS REGARDING ITEMS NOT ON THE AGENDA? DOES NOT APPEAR TO BE THE CASE. SO DID THE BOARD MEMBERS OR STAFF HAVE ANY FURTHER BUSINESS TO DISCUSS? I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING. I WON'T BE HERE FOR THE AUGUST MEETING.

SO, MEGAN, THAT MEANS YOU HAVE TO BE HERE AND YOU HAVE TO BE ON TIME.

OKAY. JUST GET IT. I WILL. I'M GOING TO MARK IT IN MY CALENDAR.

YES. I GET TO USE THE GAVEL. DO YOU WANT TO TRY IT OUT? YEAH. ALL RIGHT. ALL RIGHT. DO WE HAVE A MOTION TO ADJOURN THE MEETING? SO MOVED. I'LL MOVE TO ADJOURN IT. ALL RIGHT.

SECOND. I SECOND. OKAY. SECOND. ALL RIGHT. NOW WE GET TO VOTE.

MOTION PASSES UNANIMOUSLY. THE MEETING IS COMPLETE AT SIX, 13, 13.

* This transcript was compiled from uncorrected Closed Captioning.